Cheyenne: Thank you for joining us for this episode of What the Finance There are a few things we like to mention at the top of each episode.
Rachel: First, if you want to get in touch with us, you can email What_The_Finance@protonmail.com or join the What the Finance Discord Server.
Cheyenne: Second, it would mean a lot to us if you could support our show through Patreon. Starting at $3 a month, you can get episode shoutouts access to topic polls, and get to listen to some pretty hilarious outtakes.
Rachel: Third, as we seek to be a more inclusive show, we want to acknowledge that colonialism is an ongoing process and capitalism, which we regularly decry, is part of this process. We are recording this episode on the ancestral land of the Dakota and the Ojibwe people and we recognize our sovereignty and express our gratitude at being here.
Rachel: Welcome to this episode of What the Finance where we get to talk about health misinformation on the internet.
Cheyenne: Uh, I just opened up Pinterest because Pinterest is one of the ones that I see it on. I feel like most often, I'm not quite sure why, I don't know if it's because all of the social media stuff is so super targeted now that it's got to be because I pin yoga-related things that it targets me with the health wellness. Mhm, because I don't see it on Instagram as much as I used to, but I've also just very much started blocking certain things and I like never see it on TikTok. But Pinterest all over. Drink this mix to lose weight. I'm like ‘hmm’, could we not show people that?
Rachel: Right? Well and they're so sneaky, right? Because it's not just like drink this thing that if you think about it for 2 seconds, it seems like it would actually be really bad for you. Um, lose weight. It's like drink this thing to lose belly fat or to have a thigh gap or all these other things and it's like oh yeah, because we're already kind of at a point, I think in our culture where we all feel pretty we've uh, been targeted women especially for our entire lives, to feel insecure about our bodies.
Cheyenne: Mhm.
Rachel: Then you go, oh yeah, I don't like my belly, I should drink this thing, maybe it will help. But so one thing that I thought was yoga comment I thought was super interesting because I was reading an article, um, I guess the transcript of a PBS NewsHour episode about this exact thing. And when it seems like when health misinformation really started to explode on the internet, it started exploding because people who are doing it were coopting like yogic language to make it appeal to that group of people. Come on guys, well done for being savvy. But be savvy on the side of good, because that would be great, right?
Cheyenne: Yoga is where I tend to notice it most just because it's a topic I follow on a lot of platforms. Um, and we have turned it into fitness. And yoga is not intended to be fitness.
Rachel: Right. I guess I always not always. Um, for quite a while now, I've viewed yoga as more of, like a physical representation of the spiritual. And I know that sounds a little like woo woo, but, like, moving your body in a way that promotes spiritual healing. And so the intent is not necessarily like, your own physical fitness.
Cheyenne: So yoga and I will keep this brief because I could talk about those forever. Um, what we call yoga is the Asana part of yoga, which are the postures, movements that people often call them, poses, whatever verbiage. Um, and yoga is part of a bigger whole. And that is part of one of the issues with the health wellness industry. It took yoga and what it truly is and turned it into a health fitness fad. And that is super problematic for so many reasons. Something that I see, and I'm surprised I didn't see it. I scrolled just a smidge and didn't find anything. But often what I'll find is, like, yoga to tone your arms or yoga for a better butt or something like that. And the health wellness industry, uh, is the people who are capitalizing on it, they're doing all right because, mhm, they found a way to continue to make people feel bad about themselves, but doing it in a way, calling it self care and making it seem like it's a good thing and it's super fucked up.
Rachel: Yes.
Cheyenne: I feel like that is boiled down. Like, that is what I've been trying to say in a really nice way, and there's just no other way to say it. Like, the health and wellness industry is just that it is another industry. And again, fuck capitalism.
Rachel: Mhm. Well, one of the things that I was kind of picking up from what you were laying down, although perhaps you did not intend.
Cheyenne: To see what I.
Rachel: Was picking up from what you were laying down, is that there's also, like, a colonizing piece to this, right?
Cheyenne: Oh, yeah. Mhm, that's exactly what I was yeah, right.
Rachel: And where this is kind of this is a broad point, so I'll try to make it as compact as possible. So there's this colonizing piece to us, right? Like, yoga becomes super popular in the west. We kind of co opted it from the Indian subcontinent without really, uh, doing the work to recognize that our long history of co opting the cultures of people of color is deeply problematic. But the people, um, like, in the, quote unquote west who are sounding the alarm on, like, hey, guys, this is really problematic, are also people of color. This was a while ago, but one of the podcasts that I listened to on my own is There Are No Girls on the Internet hosted by Bridget Todd. I think you would like it.
Cheyenne: I will add that to my list.
Rachel: But she did an episode with Ifeoma Ozoma. She has her own consulting company now, but she started out at Pinterest and her job was to combat health misinformation on the platform. Because when she started in 2018, it was rampant already. And she's like, hey, this is a problem. We need to do something about this. Um, and at first, a lot of companies, they were like, oh yeah, we should do this. And look at us, we support black women and we're so awesome. But then as they started to get pushback and she kept trying to do the work, like, Pinterest started going, do we really need to be doing this work? And she slowly got pushed out. Uh, so not only are we co-opting from cultures that we already have a history of colonizing mhm, uh.
Rachel: We're also not listening to people who are saying, hey, so about this colonizing history that we have, do you think we could maybe not?
Cheyenne: Yup.
Rachel: Like we're ignoring that too.
Cheyenne: I mean, it's very hard to hear as, uh, someone who has participated in the colonization of someone else's culture that you perpetuated that, speaking as someone who was part of it. And I mean, I didn't even know at the time that that's what I was doing. Obviously, I know now, and I am, um, doing everything I can to stop doing that. But when people are telling you that that's something that you're doing, the answer is not, no I'm not. No we're not. The answer is, oh my gosh, please tell me more. Listen when they're talking to you, because I could go on forever about that, too. But I feel like the thing that I want to say is if we're using yoga as an example, because it is just the one that I'm most familiar with. Take a look at who is offering the class or who is offering the information that you are consuming on yoga. And I would encourage you to seek out people who how do I say this? Um, and now I lost my train of thought. I keep getting little rings in my ear because my headset is dying. And so it's oh no.
Rachel: Very distracting.
Cheyenne: It is.
Rachel: But I would say maybe be actively Seeking people out who are antiracist in the work that they're doing.
Cheyenne: Absolutely.
Cheyenne: Whether that is preferably, supporting a person who comes from the culture of the thing you are consuming, whether it's yoga or I was listening to another podcast recently about art created by Native Americans.
Cheyenne: Oh, yeah.
Rachel: Um. Don't buy Native inspired things. Uh, buy things that are created by actual Native people.
Cheyenne: Right.
Rachel: Uh, anything like that. So if that's available to you and we live in a global society, so there's no reason that it shouldn't be. Um, that's what you should take advantage of.
Cheyenne: Yeah, for sure. Trying to think if there were any other little points I wanted to make and I didn't even write myself little notes for this one. Usually I do, and I didn't have anything, which I feel like is actually pretty noticeable. If you're listening to this and you're like, wow, you're really scattered, let me know.
Rachel: Yeah. I will say also that What the Finance is having a big week.
Cheyenne: Yes. We are kind of all over the place right now.
Rachel: Right. Like, that's just the fact.
Cheyenne: That's true. Uh, before we started recording this, I was just talking about how we have this big weekend coming up and how my plans to have basically everything covered for the weekend are like kind of imploding. Mhm so I'm like, in my head like, okay, what am I going to do about this? And this?
Rachel: We're coming up close on time. That might be a good note to end this episode. What the Finance is having a big weekend this weekend. So if you are in the Twin Cities and um, like, nerd things, you should come to our panel at Twin Cities Con on Saturday, November 12 at 5:00 P.M.. Because Cheyenne and I are doing a panel on some of our recommendations for creating a Star Trek economy in the world we live in today. So, yeah, that's where a lot of our brain power is right now. Yeah, it's getting ready for that.
Cheyenne: If you want to interact with us more, Discord is the place to be. You can find the link for our Discord channel, I believe in our bio or description of our podcast.
Rachel: Yes. In the show notes and in the audio transcription. Yeah.
Cheyenne: And, um, we have been more active in there lately. We were quiet because it was quite busy. The beginning of the school year is a, ah, busy time, but it's starting to slow down a smidge and so it's not really slowing down. We're just getting used to the busy.
Rachel: Right. We can kind of refold social media back in.
Cheyenne: Definitely. Come chat with us there. We are often a hoot.
Rachel: Yes. Yes, we are.
Cheyenne: Some really good conversations in there.
Rachel: We do indeed.
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